Jump to content


ebuild is sad to announce its closure - it has become too time and resource intensive to develop, manage and maintain.

However, ebuild will remain on-line in archive mode (ie no posting facilties) for several weeks so that users can use it as an information resource.

Ooops, Sorry, Forgot. Professionalism In (In)Action


  • Please log in to reply
20 replies to this topic

#1 recoveringacademic

recoveringacademic

    Advanced Member

  • Moderators
  • 1,343 posts
  • LocationLancaster, Lancashire

Posted 08 April 2016 - 12:20 PM

Newts (do I ever think about anything else?)
  • Planning permission awarded, October 2015
  • Discussions about the GCN EPS licence submission , October 2015
  • Target date for EPS Licence submission, November 2015.
  • Follow up with the ecologist, December 2015 - form not submitted yet
  • Follow ups January, February , March 2016 - form not submitted yet
  • April 8th 2016, Natural England write to me thanking me for the submission which will take 30 days from the date of first submission 8th of April 2016.
7 full months to fail to submit a form.

You might like to check with me who the ecologist is if you are submitting an application for an EPS licence.

Off to treat myself to a cheese and bacon turnover, and another walk with the dogs.

If you get a weekend, have a good one.

#2 Barney12

Barney12

    Regular Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 393 posts

Posted 08 April 2016 - 01:17 PM

30 days?

My ecologist (who is also yet to submit the form as another survey needs doing*) is telling me 10 weeks minimum from submission to Natural England to get an EPS licence.
Our last survey is booked for late May and I'm being told we will be lucky to see a certificate before late August.

*probably got school fees to cover for the new term (sorry v.bitchy!)

#3 recoveringacademic

recoveringacademic

    Advanced Member

  • Moderators
  • 1,343 posts
  • LocationLancaster, Lancashire

Posted 08 April 2016 - 03:40 PM

Please Go, please God please dear God.... no

#4 jsharris

jsharris

    Please ignore all posts by me, some are erroneous

  • Member Blogger
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 11,461 posts
  • LocationWiltshire/Dorset border

Posted 08 April 2016 - 04:32 PM

That's the problem when regulations push people who are more interested in plant/animal/planet welfare than business into providing a charged for service. These people don't really see providing a service to clients/customers as their function at all; their function is to protect the plants/animals/planet, so they really have no understanding as to why anyone could get annoyed about paying them thousands of pounds and them not doing things in a timely way.

There's no commercial pressure on them, as they know they have a captive market that has to just accept their poor service and high charges.

#5 joe90

joe90

    Regular Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 847 posts

Posted 08 April 2016 - 05:13 PM

Similar to my Arboricultural method statement, I was told an arboriculturist could write me a statement ( at cost) but asking a few simple questions on here enabled me to do it myself and the councils tree man agreed it would be sufficient. I am also doing my two appeals regarding my build as I am fed up with paying "experts" to do a mediocre job.

#6 Barney12

Barney12

    Regular Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 393 posts

Posted 08 April 2016 - 05:16 PM

View Postjsharris, on 08 April 2016 - 04:32 PM, said:

That's the problem when regulations push people who are more interested in plant/animal/planet welfare than business into providing a charged for service. These people don't really see providing a service to clients/customers as their function at all; their function is to protect the plants/animals/planet, so they really have no understanding as to why anyone could get annoyed about paying them thousands of pounds and them not doing things in a timely way.

There's no commercial pressure on them, as they know they have a captive market that has to just accept their poor service and high charges.

Indeed and add to that the fact that Natural England has pretty much been deemed as "broken" and "not fit for purpose". They have suffered savage budget cuts but not reduced their internal processes. I have it on good authority from a very reliable source that EPS applications are now checked for nothing more than "have all the boxes been filled in". There is almost no appraisal of the content beyond checking key dates are within the given parameter.


#7 recoveringacademic

recoveringacademic

    Advanced Member

  • Moderators
  • 1,343 posts
  • LocationLancaster, Lancashire

Posted 08 April 2016 - 05:46 PM

Well, win some, lose some. It's Friday night - warm wife, warm beer, warm.
Ian

#8 ConstructionChannel

ConstructionChannel

    Local Youtuber

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1,723 posts
  • LocationNW Essex

Posted 08 April 2016 - 06:03 PM

View Postjsharris, on 08 April 2016 - 04:32 PM, said:

people who are more interested in plant/animal/planet

Hippies :D

we were all thinking it ;)

#9 jsharris

jsharris

    Please ignore all posts by me, some are erroneous

  • Member Blogger
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 11,461 posts
  • LocationWiltshire/Dorset border

Posted 08 April 2016 - 06:24 PM

View PostConstructionChannel, on 08 April 2016 - 06:03 PM, said:

Hippies :D

we were all thinking it ;)

I wasn't going to use that word, hence the euphemism!

(mind you, my wife only chucked out my old tie-dyed tee shirts and loons a few years ago - the Afghan coat had to go decades ago as the moths got it............)

#10 ConstructionChannel

ConstructionChannel

    Local Youtuber

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1,723 posts
  • LocationNW Essex

Posted 08 April 2016 - 06:41 PM

:lol:

#11 SteamyTea

SteamyTea

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 4,322 posts
  • LocationCornwall

Posted 09 April 2016 - 08:59 AM

I got a BSc in Environmental Science. For a laugh I used to come up with reasons as to why you could kill wildlife, just to upset my classmates.
I think one of my thought experiments involved how many more creatures got killed if more people went vegetarian. Did not go down well with the hippies.

#12 jsharris

jsharris

    Please ignore all posts by me, some are erroneous

  • Member Blogger
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 11,461 posts
  • LocationWiltshire/Dorset border

Posted 09 April 2016 - 09:11 AM

View PostSteamyTea, on 09 April 2016 - 08:59 AM, said:

I got a BSc in Environmental Science. For a laugh I used to come up with reasons as to why you could kill wildlife, just to upset my classmates.
I think one of my thought experiments involved how many more creatures got killed if more people went vegetarian. Did not go down well with the hippies.

Bit like the associates of a certain other forum owner. Some like them were responsible for the carnage caused to native wildlife when they idiotically released farmed American mink. Although that happened 30 or 40 years ago, some native wildlife species have taken decades to recover and the stupidity of these idiots has cost taxpayers millions to try and resolve. They deliberately killed millions of native animals just to make their point, which seems totally counter to their reasoning for taking the action. I think we're still trying to resolve the mink problem they caused, even now.

The odd thing is that I used to generally support the views of the less aggressive "animal rights" groups, until they invaded our village and blockaded us all in our homes, by parking over our driveways one Saturday morning. They then proceeded to berate all the residents of the village as supporters of murderers, spray paint slogans on our gates and fences and generally make a nuisance of themselves for several hours until the police had rounded up enough manpower to deal with them. Our crime? To live in a village a mile from a certain well-known defence establishment. At the time I don't think any of us affected actually worked at that establishment, either, as it was pretty small at that time, not the massive HQ for defence research it is now.

Edited by jsharris, 09 April 2016 - 04:06 PM.
typos!


#13 PeterStarck

PeterStarck

    Regular Member

  • Member Blogger
  • PipPipPip
  • 144 posts
  • LocationEast Kent

Posted 09 April 2016 - 03:48 PM

When I lived at Wrotham Heath in the 60s there was the White Ladies Mink Farm at Offham. They used to escape occasionally, don't know what happened to the place in the end.

#14 joiner

joiner

    Advanced Member

  • Moderators
  • 10,718 posts
  • LocationWest Midlands

Posted 09 April 2016 - 04:10 PM

I was at RAF Honington (a V-Bomber base back then) in 1961 when CND stormed the perimeter fence along the main road. As fast as they got over we were throwing them back until they got tired of a game we were all thoroughly enjoying.

#15 jsharris

jsharris

    Please ignore all posts by me, some are erroneous

  • Member Blogger
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 11,461 posts
  • LocationWiltshire/Dorset border

Posted 09 April 2016 - 04:45 PM

It'd be interesting to find out for sure if any of the extreme protest movements (those that took direct, physical action, breaking laws in the process) have ever made any significant change in the views of the general public, or governments, to better align them with their own objectives.

I know that the Saturday blockade of our village, together with the vandalism, was the subject of articles and letters in the local press that were overwhelmingly disapproving, with several animal charities writing letters disassociating themselves from the extremists. I heard from a former colleague associated with an animal sanctuary nearby that their donations dropped, following the spate of similar protests made by the same animal rights group around the local area. My reaction was to go from being supportive of the views of some animal rights groups to being more opposed to their objectives. My position hardened further when I received extremist animal rights spam emails, to an email address I'd only used to join a forum that I was removed from (rather oddly because I was actually agreeing with their position of supporting opposition to the daft badger cull).

My view is that extremists, supporting any cause, rarely change opinion as they would wish. The use of rational argument and positive campaigning seems to me to be more effective than direct action.

Edited by jsharris, 09 April 2016 - 04:47 PM.


#16 DavidWright

DavidWright

    Regular Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 326 posts
  • LocationSkye

Posted 09 April 2016 - 05:20 PM

View Postjsharris, on 09 April 2016 - 09:11 AM, said:

Bit like the associates of a certain other forum owner. Some like them were responsible for the carnage caused to native wildlife when they idiotically released farmed American mink. Although that happened 30 or 40 years ago, some native wildlife species have taken decades to recover and the stupidity of these idiots has cost taxpayers millions to try and resolve. They deliberately killed millions of native animals just to make their point, which seems totally counter to their reasoning for taking the action. I think we're still trying to resolve the mink problem they caused, even now.
Escaped farm mink were/are a problem with ground nesting birds in the Western Isles. SNH had a big (& expensive) campaign to remove them.
http://www.snh.gov.u...details/?id=980

I don't recall hearing any suggestion that the mink were released by activists.

Lesons learnt in the mink project are now apparently to be applied to stoats on Orkney (where they are not native)...

http://www.bbc.co.uk...slands-35978985

#17 jsharris

jsharris

    Please ignore all posts by me, some are erroneous

  • Member Blogger
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 11,461 posts
  • LocationWiltshire/Dorset border

Posted 09 April 2016 - 05:33 PM

I think the spate of activists releasing them from farms was mainly in places that were more accessible, down here in the South. Around here there was a mink farm near Ringwood where around 6,000 mink were released by animal rights activists into the New Forest, with a significant impact on native wildlife. 8,000 mink were similarly released by a similar group of activists near Stafford. There were a few other similar mass releases, but the Ringwood release fairly quickly backfired on the activists, as reports of mink attacking native wildlife, pets etc fairly quickly emerged, so that may well have caused some of these extremist groups to change their tactics. I'm sure that some mink escaped from these farms without the assistance of animal rights campaigners, but the big releases may have tended to result in large breeding populations being able to establish themselves more quickly.

The general public trend to not wear fur probably caused most of the commercial mink farms to close, rather than the actions of the extremists who would break in and release them, I think.

Edited by jsharris, 09 April 2016 - 05:39 PM.


#18 DavidWright

DavidWright

    Regular Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 326 posts
  • LocationSkye

Posted 10 April 2016 - 01:41 PM

View Postjsharris, on 09 April 2016 - 05:33 PM, said:

I think the spate of activists releasing them from farms was mainly in places that were more accessible, down here in the South. Around here there was a mink farm near Ringwood where around 6,000 mink were released by animal rights activists into the New Forest, with a significant impact on native wildlife.
A quick search found this (the headline is "Anti-fur campaigners slam mink release"):
http://news.bbc.co.u...i/uk/148420.stm

View Postjsharris, on 09 April 2016 - 05:33 PM, said:

The general public trend to not wear fur probably caused most of the commercial mink farms to close, rather than the actions of the extremists who would break in and release them, I think.
I can't recall where I picked it up (news? rumour? chat? no idea, all a very long time ago...) but I have a vague feeling/impression that at least some of the Western Isle mink might have resulted from just that, i.e. farm closes, mink released? There's more than one sort of fool in the world & more than one sort of motive... :(

PS. In case there is any doubt, I'm not, nor ever have been, an "activist". The above is not a defence of the actions. I agree that releasing mink into the wild, for whatever reason, is stupid.

Edit: add the PS.

Edited by DavidWright, 10 April 2016 - 01:43 PM.


#19 jsharris

jsharris

    Please ignore all posts by me, some are erroneous

  • Member Blogger
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 11,461 posts
  • LocationWiltshire/Dorset border

Posted 10 April 2016 - 02:04 PM

That BBC news article is the local incident I remember. You're probably right about mink farms just releasing animals when they folded or had to close because of changes in the law. The problem seems to be that mink are better at surviving here than many of our native species, a bit like the grey squirrel vs red squirrel problem.

I'm not an activist either, and I reacted badly to a certain person sending me a barrage of spam emails with an extreme animal rights agenda, with the heading "re-think", as if I needed to be brain-washed or re-educated.

#20 Alphonsox

Alphonsox

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1,495 posts
  • LocationCounty Down, NI and Forest of Dean, England

Posted 10 April 2016 - 03:09 PM

View PostDavidWright, on 10 April 2016 - 01:41 PM, said:

I can't recall where I picked it up (news? rumour? chat? no idea, all a very long time ago...) but I have a vague feeling/impression that at least some of the Western Isle mink might have resulted from just that, i.e. farm closes, mink released? There's more than one sort of fool in the world & more than one sort of motive... :(

Part of the problem is the little vermin are remarkably good swimmers and are quite capable of swimming between islands. So difficult to locate the original source. A real pest at my brother's place on Mull, they kill chicken and young turkeys in frenzy much like a fox.