Problems With Site Dimensions
Posted 07 March 2016 - 02:04 PM
If you can get enough money back from the vendor or any indemnity insurance to cover the purchase of the 3m strip from the neighbours, together with both sets of Land Registry and legal fees, then that would put you back into the position you thought you were in when your bought the land.
There is a good lesson for others to learn from here, though. Many of the members of this forum have found boundaries to be in error, luckily most of us found the errors and got them resolved one way or another before purchase, but it remains a common problem.
Posted 07 March 2016 - 03:22 PM
I.e are they really too small and that land should be yours? or they are the right size and it's just the land registry map that's wrong?
And if they are too small, does this affect both plots? is the boundary between the two plots also therefore in dispute?
Has work started on the other plot yet?
Edited by ProDave, 07 March 2016 - 03:23 PM.
Posted 07 March 2016 - 05:54 PM
Posted 07 March 2016 - 06:15 PM
Overlay.jpg 27.28K 28 downloads
There are questions that can be asked of the solicitor, the estate agent and the vendor but in the end I suspect they will all wriggle out of it. What do the estate agents particulars for the plot say? Is there a clause about errors and omissions?
There is a question mark over the validity of the planning permission. You can get planning permission on land you don't own but the owner is usually required to sign part of the application form.
I would certainly look for other aerial photos to see if you can find any evidence the fence has moved. It's very easy for the owner of the existing house to say "it's always been like that - at least since 2007" but has it?
Edited by temp, 07 March 2016 - 06:29 PM.
Posted 07 March 2016 - 07:04 PM
That is probably not what the OP wants to hear, but it is certainly looking as though they will fit without "recovering" this erxtra 3 metres.
You need to get to the site and measure with a tape measure the width of the two as fenced plots and see how that compares to the dimensions given on that plan.
Until you have done that, the only grievance appears to be the land registry plan is inaccurate and wrongly shows more land that is really included.
Posted 07 March 2016 - 09:42 PM
I am not sure of the current state of the law, but if your neighbour has occupied the disputed land for more than 12 years, it is likely you will not be able to claim it back. However, you may be able to go back to the original deeds. In the 3 cases above in my experience, the land registry had a copy of the original deeds, although this wasn't stated on all the title plans. I am guessing in your case it might be your neighbours deeds which might be most helpful? Unfortunately in 2 of the 3 cases I have had to deal with the deeds didn't include accurate measurements, so we had to revert back to deterring the boundary using 'physical boundaries'.
I would therefore a) insist the Land Registry check their archives for original deeds for the surrounding properties search for OS history of the boundaries - if you phone up the OS they can help, you might expect perhaps 4 revisions of their maps in the last 50 years. Depending on where you live you might also be able to find historic satellite images. If you google carefully enough you should be able to do this research without having to pay for it, from watermarked previews.
I have significant frustration with the Land Registry given how much it costs to register on purchasing a house. I think the law should be changed so that on exchange all parties agree to accurately measured boundaries, and not let these situations fester,
Posted 10 March 2016 - 01:09 PM
Apologies for delay in replying. We had some family issues. I was reading your posts but didn't manage to reply.
I really appreciate all the effort you all put to help us.
ProDave - Land Registry map was wrong. Planning permission was based on it. We need to buy around 3 meters of the neighbor's garden to be able to follow the project from planning permission. It's one plot. It's not divided into 2 plots yet.
Posted 10 March 2016 - 01:23 PM
I asked the solicitors, but there is a sentence in our property report from them , A copy of the Filed Plan is enclosed which shows the extent of the land being sold to you. Please ensure the boundaries outlined in red are correct and that there should be no other area of land included.... They replied that it was our responsibility to check it.
Estate agents.. I didn't even think about asking them. They didn't tell our offer to the vendor for 3 weeks. I had to find them myself and was talking to them directly I really don't know what they are for nowadays. They know only as much as on the Rightmove website. You think I should ask them about it?
I am just about to book a boundary surveyor today, I hope he will be able to tell us if we are right and what right is
ProDave - yes the houses would fit, but there need to be a driveway there.How can we skip driveway?
Edited by joiner, 11 March 2016 - 01:57 PM.
Posted 10 March 2016 - 01:45 PM
Posted 10 March 2016 - 04:23 PM
Edited by cjard, 10 March 2016 - 04:24 PM.
Posted 10 March 2016 - 05:58 PM
Posted 11 March 2016 - 05:24 PM
Would be useful to see a copy of that plan. Does it match the "white lines" on the land registry drawing or the position of the fence today?
I only really mentioned the Estate Agents because they might have some liability if they made a false representation in the details they gave out. For example they might have some liability if they quoted the site dimensions from the planning application but the dimensions of the land actually purchased are smaller.
Posted 15 March 2016 - 02:01 PM
I sent a letter to the Estate Agency. Maybe...
The Surveyor went to the site yesterday. Waiting for his maps and comments.
Posted 16 March 2016 - 10:49 AM
Posted 16 March 2016 - 11:07 AM
Of course, we would like that it would turn out like this, but to be honest, from what I read here and there already...I lost hope. Because Land Registry map is not a map you can rely on plus we signed in the contract that we checked if the boundaries are the same as on the map...
The solicitor forwarded our case to other department ...here is their answer (If you want to instruct me I propose an initial budget of 4 hours work which gives rise to costs of £849.60 inclusive of VAT and once I reach that budget I will report to you on where we are before incurring any further costs.)-
hard to spend another big sum for us
...we may pay about 5k for the missing bit (it;s the price the neighbors mentioned when we first met)
The surveyor said he can't tell us tell us the legal boundaries either. Who can than?
My plan was to start building asap and in the meantime try to chase the seller/the solicitors/land registry?? for the mistake
Posted 16 March 2016 - 06:27 PM
One concern I have is that he might not really be prepared to sell it to you for £5k. You said...
So he might be planning to claim ownership of the strip by adverse possession on the grounds that someone has occupied it illegally for more than 10 years. Any offer to purchase the land that you make to him might be used as evidence that you don't think it belongs to you and helps his claim.
It's a hard one to call.
Posted 15 April 2016 - 12:46 PM
Just a quick update if anybody interested.
Yesterday we got a map from a surveyor ...I was a bit surprised.
Just expected more from a map maybe:))
please see attached.
We are going to talk to the neighbor about buying the land tomorrow. Fingers crossed.
Posted 15 April 2016 - 06:29 PM